Karmic games
Habr is a visited and indexed resource, where I often found useful information on work. But there was no way even to comment. Received an invite for the article, published (though not in the thematic blog). But it turned out that the problems did not end there. It turned out that for the passage of publications in the thematic blogs you need a long (and tedious) to play with someone in the "karmic games." There is a problem - you need to look for solutions.
This article explores this problem and is forced because of their existence. Moved to the blog "Notes to Habr."
Just as if a person is sick, he first of all thinks about how to cure the disease, and not continue to work, I cannot continue thematic publications if they are not looked by those who need them, and, most importantly, from them the possibility of these publications depends directly.
')
So, someone minus in karma.
Here is a screenshot of karma at the time of this writing.
Screenshot of comments at the time of this writing (caution, long canvas, 310 kBa).
spmbt.habrahabr.ru/blog - my articles.
spmbt.habrahabr.ru/comments - my comments.
As can be seen in the screenshots (if they start to take advantage of them) and the links, I don’t write negative, the comments give pluses (although there were also minuses, but they were interrupted later), my rating grows. I did not ask anyone to specifically ply. I write socially useful information. Offline and off site, nobody asked to influence karma, so the experiment looks clean. The only thing that I had to publicly ask was to raise karma in the last comment for the very possibility of publishing this article, which I had prepared in the last few hours.
For several days of stay on Habré I observed a rather unexpected picture. Instead of quietly writing thematic articles and publishing them in the right section, I have no useless “struggle for survival” with an incomprehensible, at first glance, for some reason, voting anonymous users. In order to solve the problem, let's try to understand the reasons together.
I myself have sufficient experience in publications both on the subject of web development and others (30 and 15 publications on the web in about 2 years).
Here is a short history of publications on Habré.
1. Google Code Playground . Thematic article for the section "Javascript". Most people don't need online debugging and publishing. I met a cold interest, at first karma fell to -1 or -2, the article’s rating, I remember, too, but then the karma straightened to +1, and the rating to +5.
There are no other articles for the thematic publication yet - they need time, work, experiments, presentation of the material. Moreover, using the example of the first article, a doubt has crept in that the thematic article obtained by some works will not be forgotten by the inability to publish it in the right place (in the thematic blog).
Okay. Unexpectedly, the topic of working with 2 mice on 1 computer that interested me earlier appeared. I quickly searched the question and wrote about everything found.
2. 2 or more mouse pointers on the screen . The experience with the existing program, its installation, pros, cons. Must be in the "Iron" blog category. But, of course, I can’t put it there because of the small karma.
Yes, the rating met a more responsive response (up to +10), but the karma (publication goal) again hesitated around 0, it was even -1. And it is characteristic that at first they tend to minus. The addition of karma did not happen, moreover, he significantly risked dropping karma. Given that nothing antisocial, as can be seen from the publications, did not do, and the article has a certain positive interest.
Well, if such a cold interest in the topics on "Iron", try the third article, about the news with useful links. Moreover, such articles exist and are of interest.
3. Opera Downloads have tripled . And then bad luck, karma + rating began to lower again, then the readers “got it better”, the topic came out of the withered and gained advantages, and the karma rose to +1. But the next day, again, someone began to minus karma (not a rating), and very critically. After 2 days from the moment of publication, the chances of raising it are simply very small, and there is no possibility of a new publication.
Reset karma 1 time - not a solution, because I then return to the same zero, and the possibility of returning to zero is one-time.
In the out-of-site discussions, you can find complaints that a group of people formed among Habr's readers, overwhelming the entrenchment of new participants through the suppression of karma. I think that very solid evidence is not needed - it is enough to see the state of affairs and make a small calculation: how many minuses are needed per day to crush everyone. Everyone can change the karma or theme rating (one for different people) as many times as the karma had at the beginning of the day.
On the day of March 5, 17:00 until March 6, 17 hours (the link "Blogs - New" just show the data per day) 32 articles were published. Of these, only publications from the category of gags ( Habr jokes with a serious face , I received a high rating (over +20), As I did not hack anything ), the topic of interviews (interesting tasks at an interview are logical olympiad tasks) ++ - more than +10, the rest is lower and minuses. Probably, some of the publications, the authors of which have gained karma 5, have already been transferred to other blogs.
Evaluation usually takes place in the first 2 days, while on the 2nd day the activity is 5–10 percent of the first.
Thus, near-zero karma becomes a definite problem, because someone is definitely working to reduce it. For example, my karma during the publication of 3 articles has never risen above +1, and sometimes it was -2. Now, out of 15 people who influenced karma, 7 were given a Plus, and 8 people were given a minus.
As can be seen from the observations of other participants, if karma already allows you to leave personal blogs, publishing further problems with karma does not have, since it is read by a few other circle of people - following the “Thematic” link. The message quickly gains the threshold of publication on the main page, and there it is met by an even more benevolent circle of people - opening just the main page and knowing that the messages have already been liked by many.
The snag, it turns out, is in a small layer of "ideologically minus", sitting in the "Personal" section. It is not the cons in the article that are harmful, but the cons in karma. Because if the karma were +5, there would have been no problems with minuses in the article (another section of blogs is other people). The minuses are anonymous, but even if they were not so, there is still no way to ignore them.
Habramehanika methods are, of course, progressive compared to traditional forums where moderators have to contend with spam. But in this case they give an unjustifiably high threshold for passing or the need to study the subtleties of mechanics and somehow deceive the laws.
Proposals (purely for theory, but it is worth considering at least for yourself - what rules of "mechanics" would allow to avoid problems).
1) constantly minus to reduce or reset the power of minus, without saving the stock of votes. (The same can be done for pluses).
2) So that the minuses are not diluted by “pluses” to their friends, enter a page rank (in the most direct sense of Google), when mutual or cyclic “pluses” are reset. (The same can be done for the minuses. This is already going beyond the topic, since those who have near-zero karma can neither ply or minus. But just for this you need the first item - minus in unresponsive - to reduce the power of minus).
3) forum moderators usually have a line: reason for comment. In it, he must write the reason why he made the remark (or removed it). This is necessary for internal reporting to other moderators. Minus has no such reporting, anonymously and seriously affects the ability of the publication. There is no negative feedback necessary for a balanced existence of self-organizing systems. Therefore, if someone starts to limit his rights to someone with his minus, he should get an opportunity to lose something in return. At a minimum, the weight of his minus or the ability to restrict the rights of another for the same period for which he limited the rights of the first. Now, as is clear from the rules, this ability can minus karma daily and this ability is limited to its own karma minus.
4) Since karma, in theory, is a summary characteristic of a person, a direct (and immediate) influence on it is, in theory, unacceptable (this, by the way, is a position in Eastern philosophy). Karma is the sum of individual “sins”: malicious or incompetent notes, an article with unverified content, an article with content that does not correspond to the subject of the blog or resource. It is much more logical to calculate karma from the ratings of articles, reviews and other activities (from the number of own minuses, too). And indicate the "vector of karma", warning where it will move.
So far, everything. I hope that the raised problem will not only help me to restore the karma spent under the current laws of mechanics, but also give a vector of discussion about the structure of the laws themselves.
This article explores this problem and is forced because of their existence. Moved to the blog "Notes to Habr."
Just as if a person is sick, he first of all thinks about how to cure the disease, and not continue to work, I cannot continue thematic publications if they are not looked by those who need them, and, most importantly, from them the possibility of these publications depends directly.
')
So, someone minus in karma.
Here is a screenshot of karma at the time of this writing.
Screenshot of comments at the time of this writing (caution, long canvas, 310 kBa).
spmbt.habrahabr.ru/blog - my articles.
spmbt.habrahabr.ru/comments - my comments.
As can be seen in the screenshots (if they start to take advantage of them) and the links, I don’t write negative, the comments give pluses (although there were also minuses, but they were interrupted later), my rating grows. I did not ask anyone to specifically ply. I write socially useful information. Offline and off site, nobody asked to influence karma, so the experiment looks clean. The only thing that I had to publicly ask was to raise karma in the last comment for the very possibility of publishing this article, which I had prepared in the last few hours.
For several days of stay on Habré I observed a rather unexpected picture. Instead of quietly writing thematic articles and publishing them in the right section, I have no useless “struggle for survival” with an incomprehensible, at first glance, for some reason, voting anonymous users. In order to solve the problem, let's try to understand the reasons together.
I myself have sufficient experience in publications both on the subject of web development and others (30 and 15 publications on the web in about 2 years).
Here is a short history of publications on Habré.
1. Google Code Playground . Thematic article for the section "Javascript". Most people don't need online debugging and publishing. I met a cold interest, at first karma fell to -1 or -2, the article’s rating, I remember, too, but then the karma straightened to +1, and the rating to +5.
There are no other articles for the thematic publication yet - they need time, work, experiments, presentation of the material. Moreover, using the example of the first article, a doubt has crept in that the thematic article obtained by some works will not be forgotten by the inability to publish it in the right place (in the thematic blog).
Okay. Unexpectedly, the topic of working with 2 mice on 1 computer that interested me earlier appeared. I quickly searched the question and wrote about everything found.
2. 2 or more mouse pointers on the screen . The experience with the existing program, its installation, pros, cons. Must be in the "Iron" blog category. But, of course, I can’t put it there because of the small karma.
Yes, the rating met a more responsive response (up to +10), but the karma (publication goal) again hesitated around 0, it was even -1. And it is characteristic that at first they tend to minus. The addition of karma did not happen, moreover, he significantly risked dropping karma. Given that nothing antisocial, as can be seen from the publications, did not do, and the article has a certain positive interest.
Well, if such a cold interest in the topics on "Iron", try the third article, about the news with useful links. Moreover, such articles exist and are of interest.
3. Opera Downloads have tripled . And then bad luck, karma + rating began to lower again, then the readers “got it better”, the topic came out of the withered and gained advantages, and the karma rose to +1. But the next day, again, someone began to minus karma (not a rating), and very critically. After 2 days from the moment of publication, the chances of raising it are simply very small, and there is no possibility of a new publication.
Reset karma 1 time - not a solution, because I then return to the same zero, and the possibility of returning to zero is one-time.
In the out-of-site discussions, you can find complaints that a group of people formed among Habr's readers, overwhelming the entrenchment of new participants through the suppression of karma. I think that very solid evidence is not needed - it is enough to see the state of affairs and make a small calculation: how many minuses are needed per day to crush everyone. Everyone can change the karma or theme rating (one for different people) as many times as the karma had at the beginning of the day.
On the day of March 5, 17:00 until March 6, 17 hours (the link "Blogs - New" just show the data per day) 32 articles were published. Of these, only publications from the category of gags ( Habr jokes with a serious face , I received a high rating (over +20), As I did not hack anything ), the topic of interviews (interesting tasks at an interview are logical olympiad tasks) ++ - more than +10, the rest is lower and minuses. Probably, some of the publications, the authors of which have gained karma 5, have already been transferred to other blogs.
Evaluation usually takes place in the first 2 days, while on the 2nd day the activity is 5–10 percent of the first.
Thus, near-zero karma becomes a definite problem, because someone is definitely working to reduce it. For example, my karma during the publication of 3 articles has never risen above +1, and sometimes it was -2. Now, out of 15 people who influenced karma, 7 were given a Plus, and 8 people were given a minus.
As can be seen from the observations of other participants, if karma already allows you to leave personal blogs, publishing further problems with karma does not have, since it is read by a few other circle of people - following the “Thematic” link. The message quickly gains the threshold of publication on the main page, and there it is met by an even more benevolent circle of people - opening just the main page and knowing that the messages have already been liked by many.
The snag, it turns out, is in a small layer of "ideologically minus", sitting in the "Personal" section. It is not the cons in the article that are harmful, but the cons in karma. Because if the karma were +5, there would have been no problems with minuses in the article (another section of blogs is other people). The minuses are anonymous, but even if they were not so, there is still no way to ignore them.
Habramehanika methods are, of course, progressive compared to traditional forums where moderators have to contend with spam. But in this case they give an unjustifiably high threshold for passing or the need to study the subtleties of mechanics and somehow deceive the laws.
Proposals (purely for theory, but it is worth considering at least for yourself - what rules of "mechanics" would allow to avoid problems).
1) constantly minus to reduce or reset the power of minus, without saving the stock of votes. (The same can be done for pluses).
2) So that the minuses are not diluted by “pluses” to their friends, enter a page rank (in the most direct sense of Google), when mutual or cyclic “pluses” are reset. (The same can be done for the minuses. This is already going beyond the topic, since those who have near-zero karma can neither ply or minus. But just for this you need the first item - minus in unresponsive - to reduce the power of minus).
3) forum moderators usually have a line: reason for comment. In it, he must write the reason why he made the remark (or removed it). This is necessary for internal reporting to other moderators. Minus has no such reporting, anonymously and seriously affects the ability of the publication. There is no negative feedback necessary for a balanced existence of self-organizing systems. Therefore, if someone starts to limit his rights to someone with his minus, he should get an opportunity to lose something in return. At a minimum, the weight of his minus or the ability to restrict the rights of another for the same period for which he limited the rights of the first. Now, as is clear from the rules, this ability can minus karma daily and this ability is limited to its own karma minus.
4) Since karma, in theory, is a summary characteristic of a person, a direct (and immediate) influence on it is, in theory, unacceptable (this, by the way, is a position in Eastern philosophy). Karma is the sum of individual “sins”: malicious or incompetent notes, an article with unverified content, an article with content that does not correspond to the subject of the blog or resource. It is much more logical to calculate karma from the ratings of articles, reviews and other activities (from the number of own minuses, too). And indicate the "vector of karma", warning where it will move.
So far, everything. I hope that the raised problem will not only help me to restore the karma spent under the current laws of mechanics, but also give a vector of discussion about the structure of the laws themselves.
Source: https://habr.com/ru/post/86620/
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