Uneducated youth. Business response
Here on Habré a correspondence was drawn about uneducated youth and the student and teacher expressed themselves. Well, after all, obviously something is missing - namely, the opinion of the extreme in this process - the employer. We wrote this post literally in two hours, because it boiled over previous years. And it will not be a sterilized and verified article, but a cry of the soul.
The road to good work is always difficult and requires effort.
The cry of the soul of the company-developer. So, we are a small company that makes CRM systems and business software. Our system has little in common with new-minded CRMs, as it is designed for a self-respecting business that wants to live in the market for a long time happily, not two months. The system is not simple in development, it requires from the programmer not only the ownership of technology, but also business thinking, understanding of the processes (well, imagine, today we are automating a television company, tomorrow a hypermarket, and yesterday - an advertising agency or production, and everywhere the requirements are TZ-revision).
So, we have an eternal staff malnutrition in all areas: from salespeople to programmers. Yes, the guys come, we communicate, the director (he is the main developer) will personally interview each applicant for three hours. And diverge. Because there is an understanding that the person will not stay with us. Almost all of our programmers came to us as students and we all grew ourselves, starting with the language and ending with the code style. It is not surprising that such people work in the company for 10-15 years - they are ideally suited to it. But! But further a huge chain of different “but”, why such guys are less and less.
')
Approximately with such a position come the youngest, not yet seen work in business, guys. They are ambitious, courageous, even arrogant, but their ambitions are not supported by anything. And here it is, the main problem on their part - excessive expectations from the business and from work. Very precisely formulated aleshqqa1337 in his article: "I imagined myself sitting at a computer in some cool office creating a program."
Money. Young specialists (who are not even junas, but almost interns) leaf through My circle, Headhunter, listen to older comrades, look at foreign resources, absorb stories about the fabulous earnings of IT workers and ask for amounts that do not correspond to qualifications and skills. Any (lying, not any, adequate) business will raise the salary of a good employee, and more than once. But only in response to the economic effect of the employee. Simply put, you bring more to the firm - it gives you more weight thanking. But when you come and the company has to spend the effective working time of engineers on your training, she will never pay you the amount of the middle level. Just because while you are a source of costs: desk, computer, software, IDE, training, food-water, Internet, etc. And while you do not pay for these costs. So it is more realistic to relate to salary expectations.
Office. Again, on Habré you can see a lot of beautiful offices of Google, Avito, Badoo ... Sand this with a couple of films about Silicon Valley - and now the novice is looking for hammock, ottomans, board games and cribs for an afternoon nap. Cool office - in their understanding. Let's start with the fact that most IT companies, especially in the regions, are focused on ensuring that the office is modern, comfortable and working, and then all these gadgets of giants. Believe me, ottomans do not solve at all. But the level of software and readiness for learning - decides. By the way, if you don’t look at the pictures, but come to the offices of large companies (for example, at mitps), you will see that everyone is sitting and working at the monitors and laptops, and not playing or swaying in hammocks. And if they lie somewhere, then certainly with a laptop on your stomach with an open IDE, for example.
Job. I think none of the habrovchan not be surprised that the development - it is part of the code on which you work. Young people think differently (and this is a school of education): that they will come, they will sit behind a cool PC (and this is not always) and they will start to cut completely some Program, but rather a game. Nah You will come and start small — perhaps even just minimal testing. Gradually you will receive your work unit and you will commit first through the manager's review, and then yourself. If the company is involved, then you will be listened to and you will be able to offer some of your development and improvements (and even qualify for a share of their implementations). The main reason for such a gradual immersion is simple - security and trade secret. Well, the lack of necessary skills from a young employee.
Relations. And here is not all easy! The young specialist often transfers the social patterns of the students to the working rails. It is not right. You can not become a favorite of the public, perepaschivaya funny links in the working chat, telling memes and demonstrating their university knowledge. Become part of the team can only work for a common goal. If you are a good person, but an untrained and stupid worker, you will either be separated or offered to try yourself in another position. Do not aspire to fly into the team like a rocket - look around, work, listen, show yourself from the best side. Everything will develop quickly.
If you did not watch this reprise of Arkady Raikin, be sure to find and look - it very accurately reflects the controversy of recent days in Habré. In short, universities do not give us the specialists we need. Actually, this is why the schools of large companies are being opened for students - children with a good theoretical base are trained in solving practical problems, they choose the most-most and take them into commercial business. Cool, useful, convenient. But the rest also needs to work, and besides, there are graduates who are eager to get into a small company or even a startup ( we wrote about this ). And here they are, the obvious sores of university education, emerge at the beginning of the internship or the work of a young specialist (and not only a programmer!).
No systematic education. Actually - in the first year they can give the C language, and in the fourth year they can suddenly screw in algorithms. The curriculum is often built by people who are far from specific disciplines, which is why such distortions are obtained. Only one way out - from the first course to start working. No, it will not be to the detriment of study: you can always find a company with which to agree on a half-day job or with a floating schedule. During this internship, the student will understand the requirements of the business and will be able to adequately perceive the training program. And no, this is not an overload of the child - firstly, the children in school are over, and secondly, he / she alone will sit down at the computer at home. So it is better with benefit, at work and for money (for training).
Outdated curriculum. Yes, there is no one to teach - and this is a disaster. The smart ones go into business, the old ones cannot master the new, the young ones lecture from the Internet. And in order to preserve at least some kind of balance in education, methodological departments put the subjects that the state can teach. And it is the fault of those who set teachers low pornographic wages. Here's an insider literally last week - Ph.D., professor, head. Department, combining another administrative position and having the rate of training load, receives 53 000 rubles. And think for how much he went to this! What to say about young teachers - in fact, the amounts have already been named in the first answer.
Teachers who do not know the subject. Alas, it is - but not because they are so bad, but because knowing programming, engineering, administration, and in general any part of the development without practice is nonsense. But they are used to teaching, and there are almost no practitioners at the university — look for them on supplementary education programs or at corporate universities (we already wrote about this last week).
Feed the Internet. This is about the students. The Internet for a programmer is invaluable: it is the questions and answers, and forums, and open source, and training video courses, books, and Habr. But they need to be able to use and control themselves, otherwise it will turn out as it turns out: young programmers grab information on the tops, find ready-made pieces of code and drag them first to term papers and dissertations, and then to production at work. At the same time, they may not even check the operation of the code and not understand how it behaves in the program. Well, if the code found is working, then everything, consider, we have a true programmer. Well, more precisely, he thinks about himself.
Terrible practice base - and this is the fault of universities. Responsible for the practice of students send them to formal formalities with the seals, not wanting to cooperate with companies and choose internships taking into account the tripartite interest of the university, student and business. As a result, a young non-working graduate has no idea how the business, the project is organized, where the income and expenses come from, etc.
Economy, management, marketing. It's really, really bad. Those foundations that are given in universities have nothing to do with reality. Yes, it is not at all harmful to read Mescon, McConel, Kotler, etc., but you should understand that the world has changed, information technologies and the acceleration of processes have made adjustments in all areas and not everything works according to the laws that are described. So the only way out is to cram, donate and not take to heart. But what you should pay attention to is physics, mathematics, mathematical analysis and other exact disciplines. The theoretical base and mentality that these subjects provide are indispensable in the development, testing, system administration, etc.
Although for employers there is a huge shoal - we all want people with experience. In fact, this is not always the case. Business needs people who know how to delve into and learn, to rebuild in new conditions, to go deep and wide.
By the way, it is a little about the answer of teacher PavelMSTU . There is slyness in his words. For example, a completely wild argument about the fact that the economy used to require personnel, but now everything has fallen asleep. You look at vacancies of companies that they cannot close for years, assess the labor market - the modern economy requires a huge number of personnel, but at least with minimal qualifications and an understanding of how to learn to work in business.
It is necessary to study in universities, it is a fact, and we will not chew the arguments again - they are all in our recent post and in the comments to it. And a perfect lie that in universities and in business will not teach you anything. Teach! If you, of course, want to learn.
If you love IT and you are interested in getting a job at RegonSoft, we will be happy to consider your candidacy, regardless of the availability of vacancies.
We are interested in specialists in the development of IT-solutions and technical support with a wide stack of technologies, as well as experienced sales people. Call +7 (499) 709-81-41 (Moscow), +7 (831) 233-13-03 (N.Novgorod) or send a resume to personal@regionsoft.ru mail
The road to good work is always difficult and requires effort.
The cry of the soul of the company-developer. So, we are a small company that makes CRM systems and business software. Our system has little in common with new-minded CRMs, as it is designed for a self-respecting business that wants to live in the market for a long time happily, not two months. The system is not simple in development, it requires from the programmer not only the ownership of technology, but also business thinking, understanding of the processes (well, imagine, today we are automating a television company, tomorrow a hypermarket, and yesterday - an advertising agency or production, and everywhere the requirements are TZ-revision).
So, we have an eternal staff malnutrition in all areas: from salespeople to programmers. Yes, the guys come, we communicate, the director (he is the main developer) will personally interview each applicant for three hours. And diverge. Because there is an understanding that the person will not stay with us. Almost all of our programmers came to us as students and we all grew ourselves, starting with the language and ending with the code style. It is not surprising that such people work in the company for 10-15 years - they are ideally suited to it. But! But further a huge chain of different “but”, why such guys are less and less.
')
"Love me, I'm a gift"
Approximately with such a position come the youngest, not yet seen work in business, guys. They are ambitious, courageous, even arrogant, but their ambitions are not supported by anything. And here it is, the main problem on their part - excessive expectations from the business and from work. Very precisely formulated aleshqqa1337 in his article: "I imagined myself sitting at a computer in some cool office creating a program."
Money. Young specialists (who are not even junas, but almost interns) leaf through My circle, Headhunter, listen to older comrades, look at foreign resources, absorb stories about the fabulous earnings of IT workers and ask for amounts that do not correspond to qualifications and skills. Any (lying, not any, adequate) business will raise the salary of a good employee, and more than once. But only in response to the economic effect of the employee. Simply put, you bring more to the firm - it gives you more weight thanking. But when you come and the company has to spend the effective working time of engineers on your training, she will never pay you the amount of the middle level. Just because while you are a source of costs: desk, computer, software, IDE, training, food-water, Internet, etc. And while you do not pay for these costs. So it is more realistic to relate to salary expectations.
Office. Again, on Habré you can see a lot of beautiful offices of Google, Avito, Badoo ... Sand this with a couple of films about Silicon Valley - and now the novice is looking for hammock, ottomans, board games and cribs for an afternoon nap. Cool office - in their understanding. Let's start with the fact that most IT companies, especially in the regions, are focused on ensuring that the office is modern, comfortable and working, and then all these gadgets of giants. Believe me, ottomans do not solve at all. But the level of software and readiness for learning - decides. By the way, if you don’t look at the pictures, but come to the offices of large companies (for example, at mitps), you will see that everyone is sitting and working at the monitors and laptops, and not playing or swaying in hammocks. And if they lie somewhere, then certainly with a laptop on your stomach with an open IDE, for example.
Job. I think none of the habrovchan not be surprised that the development - it is part of the code on which you work. Young people think differently (and this is a school of education): that they will come, they will sit behind a cool PC (and this is not always) and they will start to cut completely some Program, but rather a game. Nah You will come and start small — perhaps even just minimal testing. Gradually you will receive your work unit and you will commit first through the manager's review, and then yourself. If the company is involved, then you will be listened to and you will be able to offer some of your development and improvements (and even qualify for a share of their implementations). The main reason for such a gradual immersion is simple - security and trade secret. Well, the lack of necessary skills from a young employee.
Relations. And here is not all easy! The young specialist often transfers the social patterns of the students to the working rails. It is not right. You can not become a favorite of the public, perepaschivaya funny links in the working chat, telling memes and demonstrating their university knowledge. Become part of the team can only work for a common goal. If you are a good person, but an untrained and stupid worker, you will either be separated or offered to try yourself in another position. Do not aspire to fly into the team like a rocket - look around, work, listen, show yourself from the best side. Everything will develop quickly.
Forget the deduction - let the products!
If you did not watch this reprise of Arkady Raikin, be sure to find and look - it very accurately reflects the controversy of recent days in Habré. In short, universities do not give us the specialists we need. Actually, this is why the schools of large companies are being opened for students - children with a good theoretical base are trained in solving practical problems, they choose the most-most and take them into commercial business. Cool, useful, convenient. But the rest also needs to work, and besides, there are graduates who are eager to get into a small company or even a startup ( we wrote about this ). And here they are, the obvious sores of university education, emerge at the beginning of the internship or the work of a young specialist (and not only a programmer!).
No systematic education. Actually - in the first year they can give the C language, and in the fourth year they can suddenly screw in algorithms. The curriculum is often built by people who are far from specific disciplines, which is why such distortions are obtained. Only one way out - from the first course to start working. No, it will not be to the detriment of study: you can always find a company with which to agree on a half-day job or with a floating schedule. During this internship, the student will understand the requirements of the business and will be able to adequately perceive the training program. And no, this is not an overload of the child - firstly, the children in school are over, and secondly, he / she alone will sit down at the computer at home. So it is better with benefit, at work and for money (for training).
Outdated curriculum. Yes, there is no one to teach - and this is a disaster. The smart ones go into business, the old ones cannot master the new, the young ones lecture from the Internet. And in order to preserve at least some kind of balance in education, methodological departments put the subjects that the state can teach. And it is the fault of those who set teachers low pornographic wages. Here's an insider literally last week - Ph.D., professor, head. Department, combining another administrative position and having the rate of training load, receives 53 000 rubles. And think for how much he went to this! What to say about young teachers - in fact, the amounts have already been named in the first answer.
Teachers who do not know the subject. Alas, it is - but not because they are so bad, but because knowing programming, engineering, administration, and in general any part of the development without practice is nonsense. But they are used to teaching, and there are almost no practitioners at the university — look for them on supplementary education programs or at corporate universities (we already wrote about this last week).
Feed the Internet. This is about the students. The Internet for a programmer is invaluable: it is the questions and answers, and forums, and open source, and training video courses, books, and Habr. But they need to be able to use and control themselves, otherwise it will turn out as it turns out: young programmers grab information on the tops, find ready-made pieces of code and drag them first to term papers and dissertations, and then to production at work. At the same time, they may not even check the operation of the code and not understand how it behaves in the program. Well, if the code found is working, then everything, consider, we have a true programmer. Well, more precisely, he thinks about himself.
Terrible practice base - and this is the fault of universities. Responsible for the practice of students send them to formal formalities with the seals, not wanting to cooperate with companies and choose internships taking into account the tripartite interest of the university, student and business. As a result, a young non-working graduate has no idea how the business, the project is organized, where the income and expenses come from, etc.
Economy, management, marketing. It's really, really bad. Those foundations that are given in universities have nothing to do with reality. Yes, it is not at all harmful to read Mescon, McConel, Kotler, etc., but you should understand that the world has changed, information technologies and the acceleration of processes have made adjustments in all areas and not everything works according to the laws that are described. So the only way out is to cram, donate and not take to heart. But what you should pay attention to is physics, mathematics, mathematical analysis and other exact disciplines. The theoretical base and mentality that these subjects provide are indispensable in the development, testing, system administration, etc.
Although for employers there is a huge shoal - we all want people with experience. In fact, this is not always the case. Business needs people who know how to delve into and learn, to rebuild in new conditions, to go deep and wide.
By the way, it is a little about the answer of teacher PavelMSTU . There is slyness in his words. For example, a completely wild argument about the fact that the economy used to require personnel, but now everything has fallen asleep. You look at vacancies of companies that they cannot close for years, assess the labor market - the modern economy requires a huge number of personnel, but at least with minimal qualifications and an understanding of how to learn to work in business.
It is necessary to study in universities, it is a fact, and we will not chew the arguments again - they are all in our recent post and in the comments to it. And a perfect lie that in universities and in business will not teach you anything. Teach! If you, of course, want to learn.
If you love IT and you are interested in getting a job at RegonSoft, we will be happy to consider your candidacy, regardless of the availability of vacancies.
We are interested in specialists in the development of IT-solutions and technical support with a wide stack of technologies, as well as experienced sales people. Call +7 (499) 709-81-41 (Moscow), +7 (831) 233-13-03 (N.Novgorod) or send a resume to personal@regionsoft.ru mail
Source: https://habr.com/ru/post/339284/
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