A very, very, very, very secret project
Today was an interesting conversation with one potential client. I think it should be attributed to the humor section, but in the middle of the conversation I wanted to send the client to hell.
Text saved, names of characters replaced.
A small note. The file that the client threw IMG_01092011_153812.png - an example of the table of contents of the document of one of his projects. One of the points was the description of the Observer pattern. I'm afraid to even imagine how carefully the programmers had to describe everything in his project.
The rest I think does not need comments.
Take the popcorn and go.
[15:17:49] CLIENT: Good!
[15:17:49] ME: ME has shared contact details with CLIENT.
[15:18:07] ME: good afternoon
[15:20:38 | Edited 15:21:11] CLIENT: Question Are you looking for a remote job? - so to speak in combination? (info: my work is not in the office)
[15:22:03] ME: yes remote
[15:23:03] CLIENT: Do you already work somewhere remotely?
[15:23:37] ME: I work as projects arrive
[15:23:46] ME: now free
[15:24:13 | Edited 15:24:29] CLIENT: Are you a self-employed freelance programmer (self-employed)?
[15:24:39] ME: I have mirco SIA
[15:25:03] CLIENT: Is there a microphone?
[15:25:16] ME: not here. houses
[15:25:56 | Edited 15:26:19] CLIENT: so you work at a main job plus remote freelancing? (there is a difference - just freelance, or permanent removal)
[15:27:17] ME: I am available for the whole day.
[15:29:07] CLIENT: all the same, it is important to understand what is actually happening. For example, can you find out where you are working now?
[15:30:15] CLIENT: for example, the issue of confidentiality, stability issues and so on here play a role.
[15:30:37] ME: support the NDA
[15:30:47] CLIENT: on the whole, it is necessary to find out by “sound”, and not text. Tex here does not give the full picture.
[15:31:21] ME: we can meet somewhere in Riga to talk
[15:31:31] CLIENT: NDA is good, I can even send NDA, but still it is important to know who I am dealing with, and so on.
[15:31:48 | Edited 15:31:59] CLIENT: better on Skype - through the sound, microphone
[15:31:56] CLIENT: or mobile phone. \
[15:32:12] ME: yes you can by mobile if convenient
[15:33:24] CLIENT: Ok, since NDA), then, can you send the documentation to some module? say client server?
[15:35:45] ME: Why send this to you
[15:35:59] ME: what is your doubt
[15:36:06] ME: what scares you
[15:36:44 | Edited 15:36:53] CLIENT: because we are not doing serious projects without documentation, we need to look at the example of documentation. Tk. These are not business cards sites))
[15:38:02] *** CLIENT sent IMG_01092011_153812.png ***
[15:45:44] ME: yes, there are also serious drafts with documentation
[15:48:03] CLIENT: send a table of contents, only business cards can be made without documentation. well, or very simple shops, on simple CMS. I have 4 of my projects and work only with the documentation, all by daddy and so on. object oriented))
[16:19:51] *** ME sent Table of contents.docx ***
[16:20:02] ME: real estate portal
[16:21:10] ME: who is involved in the project managment?
[16:21:15] CLIENT: I ​​myself.
[16:21:36] CLIENT: what you have sent, I do it immediately with screenshots.
[16:21:36] ME: documentation is not a problem the main thing is to know what the result is for
[16:22:44] ME: I propose to start working and decide to approach each other there or not
[16:22:58] ME: in any case, we can sign the contract and the NDA
[16:23:14] ME: as I see you are in Austria?
[16:23:21] CLIENT: in the winter ...
[16:23:26] ME: aah
[16:24:08] ME: what else do you need to confirm singing the candidature?
[16:24:36] CLIENT: [16:22] ME:
<<< I propose to start working there and decide whether we are close to each other or not
I do not think of such parameters. Those who have lost their minds are personal parameters)), and here it is different, documenting the code ... that's what's important))
[16:25:25] ME: this is not a problem
[16:27:55] CLIENT: You’ll have to talk on the phone. In principle, “not a problem” does not mean that there will be no problems. Documentation, sample code - that's what I need.
[16:28:28 | Edited 16:28:34] CLIENT: real estate portal - this is nonsense)
[16:28:41] ME: What are your projects?
[16:28:48] ME: Military?
[16:28:59] ME: what a secret
[16:30:12 | | Edited 16:30:23] CLIENT: send a sample of the documentation for the module you wrote, preferably MVC, ajax, SQL
[16:33:00] CLIENT: money poured on the programmer, without documentation and without a commented year, without code pattern code - this is money thrown to the wind. Tk. Immediately it is monotonous that such a programmer, a sniper, made a crooked code. Without documentation, no refactoring is sensible. all in the end - there is a time spent, which can not be redeemed back and so.
[16:33:23] CLIENT: I ​​know, I have experience))). both negative and positive there.))
[16:33:52] ME: it's all clear
[16:34:22] CLIENT: and the nedvizhki portal - it can be without documentation ... they are usually too simple and there you can figure out the code in a day if it is normal
[16:34:25] ME: Not all customers are willing to pay for the development of documentation.
[16:34:54] ME: insurance system at what level do you put it?
[16:36:35] CLIENT: these are their problems - if they do not want documentation. There is not even the life and speech that without it))
[16:36:39] ME: Your idealist approach is welcome, but in reality it’s not like that. and what other result do you want to get
[16:38:26] CLIENT: mine was acquired in 3 years, and 4 programmers, paradigm shifts, money spent, as a result, empty - this is a big project for one thing.
[16:38:46] ME: tell me the essence of the project
[16:39:13] ME: if students did students in Latvia, then I am not surprised. at the very experience
[16:39:30] CLIENT: there is no time to tell the essence - this is not the main thing for the programmer. the essence is generally a secret.
[16:39:45] ME: well, the theme of the project?
[16:39:56] ME: just evaluate your strength
[16:40:37] ME: government project?
[16:40:38] CLIENT: social content on widgets. but there are simple projects
[16:41:17] ME: well, ok, there is a social is a widget mechanism
[16:41:23] ME: where is the problem?
[16:42:35] ME: here either you trust the project management to knowledgeable people or you control yourself and understand everything what is happening
[16:42:40] CLIENT: if there is no documentation, which in the course of the project is usually supplemented with, and then the work does not begin. then code inspection, and only then payment.
[16:43:21] CLIENT: [16:42] ME:
')
<<< here either you trust the project management to know people or you control yourself and everyone understands what is going on knowing people - so they say about themselves, everything)) - therefore, I had to become really knowledgeable myself)))
[16:43:34] ME: you say what needs to be done I estimate the time for development and documentation
[16:44:11] ME: well, I’m aware, but I didn’t talk specifically about myself
[16:44:20] ME: I just do it. who can you trust
[16:44:53 | Edited 16:44:58] CLIENT: instead of trusting anyone, if you do everything according to science, then trust is not required.
[16:46:26] CLIENT: for example: why believe that the programmer will then help another supposedly figure it out in his code ?? - what for? such trust will somehow be deceived, and such things should be decided once and for all by the documentation. and believe it works.
[16:47:09] CLIENT: for example, it takes about 3 months to choose the right platform and so on.
[16:47:26] ME: good
[16:47:39] ME: do you type teams or what is your goal?
[16:48:07] ME: make the module you check and pay
[16:48:30] ME: sign the NDA and see no problems on my part
[16:48:58] ME: it’s profitable for me to continue cooperation
[16:49:03] CLIENT: I’m not typing commands. 1-2-3 programmer is enough.
[16:49:29] ME: I have 2 partners yet
[16:50:17] ME: I don’t see any problems yet
[16:50:25] ME: give the task I do it
[16:50:36] ME: what else do you need from me?
[16:55:19] CLIENT: partners - which partners)
[16:56:16] CLIENT: we are not a blacksmith, nezhuen))
[17:01:32] ME: Well, I mean, if you need more people
[17:05:08] CLIENT: which company do you represent?
[17:05:40] ME: XXX
[17:07:20 | Edited 17:07:32] CLIENT: ugly site) (wasntme)
[17:07:38] ME: well, I'm not a designer
[17:15:16] CLIENT: Dmitry, today I can’t talk anymore. Partners - it's bad here, tk. The issue of information security through the NDA is not solved, and so. It would be better if you were without patners. In general, I propose to put the relationship on Hold - waiting for the right combination of "stars in the sky."
[17:15:29 | Edited 17:15:48] CLIENT: I ​​am in the best sense. I can't promise anything else now. OK?
[17:15:54] ME: help you DJ
Text saved, names of characters replaced.
A small note. The file that the client threw IMG_01092011_153812.png - an example of the table of contents of the document of one of his projects. One of the points was the description of the Observer pattern. I'm afraid to even imagine how carefully the programmers had to describe everything in his project.
The rest I think does not need comments.
Take the popcorn and go.
[15:17:49] CLIENT: Good!
[15:17:49] ME: ME has shared contact details with CLIENT.
[15:18:07] ME: good afternoon
[15:20:38 | Edited 15:21:11] CLIENT: Question Are you looking for a remote job? - so to speak in combination? (info: my work is not in the office)
[15:22:03] ME: yes remote
[15:23:03] CLIENT: Do you already work somewhere remotely?
[15:23:37] ME: I work as projects arrive
[15:23:46] ME: now free
[15:24:13 | Edited 15:24:29] CLIENT: Are you a self-employed freelance programmer (self-employed)?
[15:24:39] ME: I have mirco SIA
[15:25:03] CLIENT: Is there a microphone?
[15:25:16] ME: not here. houses
[15:25:56 | Edited 15:26:19] CLIENT: so you work at a main job plus remote freelancing? (there is a difference - just freelance, or permanent removal)
[15:27:17] ME: I am available for the whole day.
[15:29:07] CLIENT: all the same, it is important to understand what is actually happening. For example, can you find out where you are working now?
[15:30:15] CLIENT: for example, the issue of confidentiality, stability issues and so on here play a role.
[15:30:37] ME: support the NDA
[15:30:47] CLIENT: on the whole, it is necessary to find out by “sound”, and not text. Tex here does not give the full picture.
[15:31:21] ME: we can meet somewhere in Riga to talk
[15:31:31] CLIENT: NDA is good, I can even send NDA, but still it is important to know who I am dealing with, and so on.
[15:31:48 | Edited 15:31:59] CLIENT: better on Skype - through the sound, microphone
[15:31:56] CLIENT: or mobile phone. \
[15:32:12] ME: yes you can by mobile if convenient
[15:33:24] CLIENT: Ok, since NDA), then, can you send the documentation to some module? say client server?
[15:35:45] ME: Why send this to you
[15:35:59] ME: what is your doubt
[15:36:06] ME: what scares you
[15:36:44 | Edited 15:36:53] CLIENT: because we are not doing serious projects without documentation, we need to look at the example of documentation. Tk. These are not business cards sites))
[15:38:02] *** CLIENT sent IMG_01092011_153812.png ***
[15:45:44] ME: yes, there are also serious drafts with documentation
[15:48:03] CLIENT: send a table of contents, only business cards can be made without documentation. well, or very simple shops, on simple CMS. I have 4 of my projects and work only with the documentation, all by daddy and so on. object oriented))
[16:19:51] *** ME sent Table of contents.docx ***
[16:20:02] ME: real estate portal
[16:21:10] ME: who is involved in the project managment?
[16:21:15] CLIENT: I ​​myself.
[16:21:36] CLIENT: what you have sent, I do it immediately with screenshots.
[16:21:36] ME: documentation is not a problem the main thing is to know what the result is for
[16:22:44] ME: I propose to start working and decide to approach each other there or not
[16:22:58] ME: in any case, we can sign the contract and the NDA
[16:23:14] ME: as I see you are in Austria?
[16:23:21] CLIENT: in the winter ...
[16:23:26] ME: aah
[16:24:08] ME: what else do you need to confirm singing the candidature?
[16:24:36] CLIENT: [16:22] ME:
<<< I propose to start working there and decide whether we are close to each other or not
I do not think of such parameters. Those who have lost their minds are personal parameters)), and here it is different, documenting the code ... that's what's important))
[16:25:25] ME: this is not a problem
[16:27:55] CLIENT: You’ll have to talk on the phone. In principle, “not a problem” does not mean that there will be no problems. Documentation, sample code - that's what I need.
[16:28:28 | Edited 16:28:34] CLIENT: real estate portal - this is nonsense)
[16:28:41] ME: What are your projects?
[16:28:48] ME: Military?
[16:28:59] ME: what a secret
[16:30:12 | | Edited 16:30:23] CLIENT: send a sample of the documentation for the module you wrote, preferably MVC, ajax, SQL
[16:33:00] CLIENT: money poured on the programmer, without documentation and without a commented year, without code pattern code - this is money thrown to the wind. Tk. Immediately it is monotonous that such a programmer, a sniper, made a crooked code. Without documentation, no refactoring is sensible. all in the end - there is a time spent, which can not be redeemed back and so.
[16:33:23] CLIENT: I ​​know, I have experience))). both negative and positive there.))
[16:33:52] ME: it's all clear
[16:34:22] CLIENT: and the nedvizhki portal - it can be without documentation ... they are usually too simple and there you can figure out the code in a day if it is normal
[16:34:25] ME: Not all customers are willing to pay for the development of documentation.
[16:34:54] ME: insurance system at what level do you put it?
[16:36:35] CLIENT: these are their problems - if they do not want documentation. There is not even the life and speech that without it))
[16:36:39] ME: Your idealist approach is welcome, but in reality it’s not like that. and what other result do you want to get
[16:38:26] CLIENT: mine was acquired in 3 years, and 4 programmers, paradigm shifts, money spent, as a result, empty - this is a big project for one thing.
[16:38:46] ME: tell me the essence of the project
[16:39:13] ME: if students did students in Latvia, then I am not surprised. at the very experience
[16:39:30] CLIENT: there is no time to tell the essence - this is not the main thing for the programmer. the essence is generally a secret.
[16:39:45] ME: well, the theme of the project?
[16:39:56] ME: just evaluate your strength
[16:40:37] ME: government project?
[16:40:38] CLIENT: social content on widgets. but there are simple projects
[16:41:17] ME: well, ok, there is a social is a widget mechanism
[16:41:23] ME: where is the problem?
[16:42:35] ME: here either you trust the project management to knowledgeable people or you control yourself and understand everything what is happening
[16:42:40] CLIENT: if there is no documentation, which in the course of the project is usually supplemented with, and then the work does not begin. then code inspection, and only then payment.
[16:43:21] CLIENT: [16:42] ME:
')
<<< here either you trust the project management to know people or you control yourself and everyone understands what is going on knowing people - so they say about themselves, everything)) - therefore, I had to become really knowledgeable myself)))
[16:43:34] ME: you say what needs to be done I estimate the time for development and documentation
[16:44:11] ME: well, I’m aware, but I didn’t talk specifically about myself
[16:44:20] ME: I just do it. who can you trust
[16:44:53 | Edited 16:44:58] CLIENT: instead of trusting anyone, if you do everything according to science, then trust is not required.
[16:46:26] CLIENT: for example: why believe that the programmer will then help another supposedly figure it out in his code ?? - what for? such trust will somehow be deceived, and such things should be decided once and for all by the documentation. and believe it works.
[16:47:09] CLIENT: for example, it takes about 3 months to choose the right platform and so on.
[16:47:26] ME: good
[16:47:39] ME: do you type teams or what is your goal?
[16:48:07] ME: make the module you check and pay
[16:48:30] ME: sign the NDA and see no problems on my part
[16:48:58] ME: it’s profitable for me to continue cooperation
[16:49:03] CLIENT: I’m not typing commands. 1-2-3 programmer is enough.
[16:49:29] ME: I have 2 partners yet
[16:50:17] ME: I don’t see any problems yet
[16:50:25] ME: give the task I do it
[16:50:36] ME: what else do you need from me?
[16:55:19] CLIENT: partners - which partners)
[16:56:16] CLIENT: we are not a blacksmith, nezhuen))
[17:01:32] ME: Well, I mean, if you need more people
[17:05:08] CLIENT: which company do you represent?
[17:05:40] ME: XXX
[17:07:20 | Edited 17:07:32] CLIENT: ugly site) (wasntme)
[17:07:38] ME: well, I'm not a designer
[17:15:16] CLIENT: Dmitry, today I can’t talk anymore. Partners - it's bad here, tk. The issue of information security through the NDA is not solved, and so. It would be better if you were without patners. In general, I propose to put the relationship on Hold - waiting for the right combination of "stars in the sky."
[17:15:29 | Edited 17:15:48] CLIENT: I ​​am in the best sense. I can't promise anything else now. OK?
[17:15:54] ME: help you DJ
Source: https://habr.com/ru/post/127548/
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